Is this definition well-posed? [closed]
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-2
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I have this definition: "Let $Rinmathbb{N}$ be called arbitrarily large if and only if
$$
forallquad xinmathbb{N}quadexistsquad Rinmathbb{N}quad:quad x<R~~text{''}
$$
When I wrote it, I was thinking $forall$ meant "for any," but now I see that it means "for all." (Probably why LaTeX symbol is called forall.) I think this definition makes sense and is well posed because $mathbb{N}$ is an open set whose supremum is not in $mathbb{N}$.
Is this definition ok or is it problematic? When I use, "for all" in my head I say, "Choose $x=R$, then is $R$ greater to itself?" The answer must be no, but my intention in constructing the definition was that $R$ cannot be chosen and instead only exists as a concept.
What I mean by that is if you take $x=R$ then I will say, "Which natural number is that?" The counterpart will say its ten million and five," and then I would say, "That number does not have the requisite property to be called $R$ because it is less that ten million and six."
Is this definition ok or inherently stupid?
real-analysis
closed as unclear what you're asking by TheGeekGreek, Chinnapparaj R, Leucippus, Lord Shark the Unknown, Parcly Taxel Nov 17 at 8:52
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
|
show 3 more comments
up vote
-2
down vote
favorite
I have this definition: "Let $Rinmathbb{N}$ be called arbitrarily large if and only if
$$
forallquad xinmathbb{N}quadexistsquad Rinmathbb{N}quad:quad x<R~~text{''}
$$
When I wrote it, I was thinking $forall$ meant "for any," but now I see that it means "for all." (Probably why LaTeX symbol is called forall.) I think this definition makes sense and is well posed because $mathbb{N}$ is an open set whose supremum is not in $mathbb{N}$.
Is this definition ok or is it problematic? When I use, "for all" in my head I say, "Choose $x=R$, then is $R$ greater to itself?" The answer must be no, but my intention in constructing the definition was that $R$ cannot be chosen and instead only exists as a concept.
What I mean by that is if you take $x=R$ then I will say, "Which natural number is that?" The counterpart will say its ten million and five," and then I would say, "That number does not have the requisite property to be called $R$ because it is less that ten million and six."
Is this definition ok or inherently stupid?
real-analysis
closed as unclear what you're asking by TheGeekGreek, Chinnapparaj R, Leucippus, Lord Shark the Unknown, Parcly Taxel Nov 17 at 8:52
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
2
There is no such $R$. Whether you call it "for any" or "for all" is irrelevant to this point. You have 90% of a proof of this statement in your question. So yes, I suppose it's a perfectly valid definition, it's just that the first (and last interesting) theorem that you'll prove about it is "no natural number is arbitrarily large".
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:20
I see. I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:27
Precisely the same, for precisely the same reason.
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:29
1
It sounds like you're trying to construct an infinity in the natural numbers, where infinity is greater than all natural numbers. There's something called the extended natural numbers, which describes exactly that.
– Kevin Long
Nov 16 at 23:30
I think this is what is what I was going for: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:41
|
show 3 more comments
up vote
-2
down vote
favorite
up vote
-2
down vote
favorite
I have this definition: "Let $Rinmathbb{N}$ be called arbitrarily large if and only if
$$
forallquad xinmathbb{N}quadexistsquad Rinmathbb{N}quad:quad x<R~~text{''}
$$
When I wrote it, I was thinking $forall$ meant "for any," but now I see that it means "for all." (Probably why LaTeX symbol is called forall.) I think this definition makes sense and is well posed because $mathbb{N}$ is an open set whose supremum is not in $mathbb{N}$.
Is this definition ok or is it problematic? When I use, "for all" in my head I say, "Choose $x=R$, then is $R$ greater to itself?" The answer must be no, but my intention in constructing the definition was that $R$ cannot be chosen and instead only exists as a concept.
What I mean by that is if you take $x=R$ then I will say, "Which natural number is that?" The counterpart will say its ten million and five," and then I would say, "That number does not have the requisite property to be called $R$ because it is less that ten million and six."
Is this definition ok or inherently stupid?
real-analysis
I have this definition: "Let $Rinmathbb{N}$ be called arbitrarily large if and only if
$$
forallquad xinmathbb{N}quadexistsquad Rinmathbb{N}quad:quad x<R~~text{''}
$$
When I wrote it, I was thinking $forall$ meant "for any," but now I see that it means "for all." (Probably why LaTeX symbol is called forall.) I think this definition makes sense and is well posed because $mathbb{N}$ is an open set whose supremum is not in $mathbb{N}$.
Is this definition ok or is it problematic? When I use, "for all" in my head I say, "Choose $x=R$, then is $R$ greater to itself?" The answer must be no, but my intention in constructing the definition was that $R$ cannot be chosen and instead only exists as a concept.
What I mean by that is if you take $x=R$ then I will say, "Which natural number is that?" The counterpart will say its ten million and five," and then I would say, "That number does not have the requisite property to be called $R$ because it is less that ten million and six."
Is this definition ok or inherently stupid?
real-analysis
real-analysis
edited Nov 17 at 6:49
idea
1,94731024
1,94731024
asked Nov 16 at 23:16
Jonathan Tooker
41
41
closed as unclear what you're asking by TheGeekGreek, Chinnapparaj R, Leucippus, Lord Shark the Unknown, Parcly Taxel Nov 17 at 8:52
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
closed as unclear what you're asking by TheGeekGreek, Chinnapparaj R, Leucippus, Lord Shark the Unknown, Parcly Taxel Nov 17 at 8:52
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
2
There is no such $R$. Whether you call it "for any" or "for all" is irrelevant to this point. You have 90% of a proof of this statement in your question. So yes, I suppose it's a perfectly valid definition, it's just that the first (and last interesting) theorem that you'll prove about it is "no natural number is arbitrarily large".
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:20
I see. I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:27
Precisely the same, for precisely the same reason.
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:29
1
It sounds like you're trying to construct an infinity in the natural numbers, where infinity is greater than all natural numbers. There's something called the extended natural numbers, which describes exactly that.
– Kevin Long
Nov 16 at 23:30
I think this is what is what I was going for: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:41
|
show 3 more comments
2
There is no such $R$. Whether you call it "for any" or "for all" is irrelevant to this point. You have 90% of a proof of this statement in your question. So yes, I suppose it's a perfectly valid definition, it's just that the first (and last interesting) theorem that you'll prove about it is "no natural number is arbitrarily large".
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:20
I see. I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:27
Precisely the same, for precisely the same reason.
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:29
1
It sounds like you're trying to construct an infinity in the natural numbers, where infinity is greater than all natural numbers. There's something called the extended natural numbers, which describes exactly that.
– Kevin Long
Nov 16 at 23:30
I think this is what is what I was going for: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:41
2
2
There is no such $R$. Whether you call it "for any" or "for all" is irrelevant to this point. You have 90% of a proof of this statement in your question. So yes, I suppose it's a perfectly valid definition, it's just that the first (and last interesting) theorem that you'll prove about it is "no natural number is arbitrarily large".
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:20
There is no such $R$. Whether you call it "for any" or "for all" is irrelevant to this point. You have 90% of a proof of this statement in your question. So yes, I suppose it's a perfectly valid definition, it's just that the first (and last interesting) theorem that you'll prove about it is "no natural number is arbitrarily large".
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:20
I see. I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:27
I see. I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:27
Precisely the same, for precisely the same reason.
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:29
Precisely the same, for precisely the same reason.
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:29
1
1
It sounds like you're trying to construct an infinity in the natural numbers, where infinity is greater than all natural numbers. There's something called the extended natural numbers, which describes exactly that.
– Kevin Long
Nov 16 at 23:30
It sounds like you're trying to construct an infinity in the natural numbers, where infinity is greater than all natural numbers. There's something called the extended natural numbers, which describes exactly that.
– Kevin Long
Nov 16 at 23:30
I think this is what is what I was going for: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:41
I think this is what is what I was going for: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:41
|
show 3 more comments
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
It's not really meaningful to speak about whether a single number is "arbitrarily large" or not.
What one does often speak of is things like "$P(x)$ holds for arbitrarily large $x$". That can be formalized as
"$P(x)$ holds for arbitarily large $x$" means
$$ forall ninmathbb N : exists x>n : P(x) $$
-- in other words, no matter how large an $n$ you're thinking of, you can find an even larger $x$ with the property $P$.
A related notion is
"$P(x)$ holds for all sufficiently large $x$" means
$$ exists ninmathbb N : forall x>n : P(x) $$
Note that both of these are claims about the property $P$. They don't say something about any particular number $n$ or $x$.
This is the best comment. Thank you Henning!
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 1:12
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
An issue nobody pointed out is that you define a property about a number $R$, but in your definition you quantify over $R$. This doesn't make sense.
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
Such $R$ doesn't exists, we can refer to a sequence $a_n$ (that is a function $mathbb{N}to mathbb{R}$) arbitrarly large for example when we deal with limits stating that
$$forall Rinmathbb{N} quad exists xinmathbb{N}quad forall nge xquad a_nge R$$
and in that case we say that $a_n to infty$.
Thank you! I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:28
You definition is not well posed (that is it is not true). In the definition given here for the limit we can use both $a_nge R$ or $a_n> R$.
– gimusi
Nov 16 at 23:31
I think I will use this: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X $
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:44
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
According to your definition no natural number is arbitrary large so why are you trying to define something which you know it does not exist?
You may want to define the concept of a sequence diverging to infinity in which case you have a sequence $R_n$ which gets larger than any arbitrary number.
The issue was that did not even realize the implication that no such R exists until after I wrote it and ha it explained to me here! This is the one I think I will use instead: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:40
The new definition in not very helpful either.Your set $X$ is an empty set because there is no real number larger than all natural numbers. You have added "and R=inf X" where in case of the empty set the infimum is infinity and infinity is not a real number.
– Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
Nov 17 at 0:47
Actually, the topic of the paper I'm writing is precisely that there are real numbers larger than every natural number. I have a draft with a serious error in it (the one I made this question about) and you can have look if you ignore the catastrophically wrong error in Def 1.3: vixra.org/abs/1811.0222
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:56
In your paper, you postulate the existence of a number greater than any real number. Then you claim there are real numbers greater than it. That is nonsense.
– Sambo
Nov 17 at 6:19
add a comment |
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
It's not really meaningful to speak about whether a single number is "arbitrarily large" or not.
What one does often speak of is things like "$P(x)$ holds for arbitrarily large $x$". That can be formalized as
"$P(x)$ holds for arbitarily large $x$" means
$$ forall ninmathbb N : exists x>n : P(x) $$
-- in other words, no matter how large an $n$ you're thinking of, you can find an even larger $x$ with the property $P$.
A related notion is
"$P(x)$ holds for all sufficiently large $x$" means
$$ exists ninmathbb N : forall x>n : P(x) $$
Note that both of these are claims about the property $P$. They don't say something about any particular number $n$ or $x$.
This is the best comment. Thank you Henning!
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 1:12
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
It's not really meaningful to speak about whether a single number is "arbitrarily large" or not.
What one does often speak of is things like "$P(x)$ holds for arbitrarily large $x$". That can be formalized as
"$P(x)$ holds for arbitarily large $x$" means
$$ forall ninmathbb N : exists x>n : P(x) $$
-- in other words, no matter how large an $n$ you're thinking of, you can find an even larger $x$ with the property $P$.
A related notion is
"$P(x)$ holds for all sufficiently large $x$" means
$$ exists ninmathbb N : forall x>n : P(x) $$
Note that both of these are claims about the property $P$. They don't say something about any particular number $n$ or $x$.
This is the best comment. Thank you Henning!
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 1:12
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
It's not really meaningful to speak about whether a single number is "arbitrarily large" or not.
What one does often speak of is things like "$P(x)$ holds for arbitrarily large $x$". That can be formalized as
"$P(x)$ holds for arbitarily large $x$" means
$$ forall ninmathbb N : exists x>n : P(x) $$
-- in other words, no matter how large an $n$ you're thinking of, you can find an even larger $x$ with the property $P$.
A related notion is
"$P(x)$ holds for all sufficiently large $x$" means
$$ exists ninmathbb N : forall x>n : P(x) $$
Note that both of these are claims about the property $P$. They don't say something about any particular number $n$ or $x$.
It's not really meaningful to speak about whether a single number is "arbitrarily large" or not.
What one does often speak of is things like "$P(x)$ holds for arbitrarily large $x$". That can be formalized as
"$P(x)$ holds for arbitarily large $x$" means
$$ forall ninmathbb N : exists x>n : P(x) $$
-- in other words, no matter how large an $n$ you're thinking of, you can find an even larger $x$ with the property $P$.
A related notion is
"$P(x)$ holds for all sufficiently large $x$" means
$$ exists ninmathbb N : forall x>n : P(x) $$
Note that both of these are claims about the property $P$. They don't say something about any particular number $n$ or $x$.
edited Nov 17 at 6:44
answered Nov 17 at 0:56
Henning Makholm
236k16300534
236k16300534
This is the best comment. Thank you Henning!
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 1:12
add a comment |
This is the best comment. Thank you Henning!
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 1:12
This is the best comment. Thank you Henning!
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 1:12
This is the best comment. Thank you Henning!
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 1:12
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
An issue nobody pointed out is that you define a property about a number $R$, but in your definition you quantify over $R$. This doesn't make sense.
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
An issue nobody pointed out is that you define a property about a number $R$, but in your definition you quantify over $R$. This doesn't make sense.
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
An issue nobody pointed out is that you define a property about a number $R$, but in your definition you quantify over $R$. This doesn't make sense.
An issue nobody pointed out is that you define a property about a number $R$, but in your definition you quantify over $R$. This doesn't make sense.
answered Nov 17 at 0:38
Sambo
2,1112532
2,1112532
add a comment |
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
Such $R$ doesn't exists, we can refer to a sequence $a_n$ (that is a function $mathbb{N}to mathbb{R}$) arbitrarly large for example when we deal with limits stating that
$$forall Rinmathbb{N} quad exists xinmathbb{N}quad forall nge xquad a_nge R$$
and in that case we say that $a_n to infty$.
Thank you! I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:28
You definition is not well posed (that is it is not true). In the definition given here for the limit we can use both $a_nge R$ or $a_n> R$.
– gimusi
Nov 16 at 23:31
I think I will use this: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X $
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:44
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
Such $R$ doesn't exists, we can refer to a sequence $a_n$ (that is a function $mathbb{N}to mathbb{R}$) arbitrarly large for example when we deal with limits stating that
$$forall Rinmathbb{N} quad exists xinmathbb{N}quad forall nge xquad a_nge R$$
and in that case we say that $a_n to infty$.
Thank you! I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:28
You definition is not well posed (that is it is not true). In the definition given here for the limit we can use both $a_nge R$ or $a_n> R$.
– gimusi
Nov 16 at 23:31
I think I will use this: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X $
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:44
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Such $R$ doesn't exists, we can refer to a sequence $a_n$ (that is a function $mathbb{N}to mathbb{R}$) arbitrarly large for example when we deal with limits stating that
$$forall Rinmathbb{N} quad exists xinmathbb{N}quad forall nge xquad a_nge R$$
and in that case we say that $a_n to infty$.
Such $R$ doesn't exists, we can refer to a sequence $a_n$ (that is a function $mathbb{N}to mathbb{R}$) arbitrarly large for example when we deal with limits stating that
$$forall Rinmathbb{N} quad exists xinmathbb{N}quad forall nge xquad a_nge R$$
and in that case we say that $a_n to infty$.
edited Nov 16 at 23:26
answered Nov 16 at 23:21
gimusi
90k74495
90k74495
Thank you! I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:28
You definition is not well posed (that is it is not true). In the definition given here for the limit we can use both $a_nge R$ or $a_n> R$.
– gimusi
Nov 16 at 23:31
I think I will use this: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X $
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:44
add a comment |
Thank you! I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:28
You definition is not well posed (that is it is not true). In the definition given here for the limit we can use both $a_nge R$ or $a_n> R$.
– gimusi
Nov 16 at 23:31
I think I will use this: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X $
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:44
Thank you! I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:28
Thank you! I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:28
You definition is not well posed (that is it is not true). In the definition given here for the limit we can use both $a_nge R$ or $a_n> R$.
– gimusi
Nov 16 at 23:31
You definition is not well posed (that is it is not true). In the definition given here for the limit we can use both $a_nge R$ or $a_n> R$.
– gimusi
Nov 16 at 23:31
I think I will use this: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X $
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:44
I think I will use this: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X $
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:44
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
According to your definition no natural number is arbitrary large so why are you trying to define something which you know it does not exist?
You may want to define the concept of a sequence diverging to infinity in which case you have a sequence $R_n$ which gets larger than any arbitrary number.
The issue was that did not even realize the implication that no such R exists until after I wrote it and ha it explained to me here! This is the one I think I will use instead: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:40
The new definition in not very helpful either.Your set $X$ is an empty set because there is no real number larger than all natural numbers. You have added "and R=inf X" where in case of the empty set the infimum is infinity and infinity is not a real number.
– Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
Nov 17 at 0:47
Actually, the topic of the paper I'm writing is precisely that there are real numbers larger than every natural number. I have a draft with a serious error in it (the one I made this question about) and you can have look if you ignore the catastrophically wrong error in Def 1.3: vixra.org/abs/1811.0222
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:56
In your paper, you postulate the existence of a number greater than any real number. Then you claim there are real numbers greater than it. That is nonsense.
– Sambo
Nov 17 at 6:19
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
According to your definition no natural number is arbitrary large so why are you trying to define something which you know it does not exist?
You may want to define the concept of a sequence diverging to infinity in which case you have a sequence $R_n$ which gets larger than any arbitrary number.
The issue was that did not even realize the implication that no such R exists until after I wrote it and ha it explained to me here! This is the one I think I will use instead: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:40
The new definition in not very helpful either.Your set $X$ is an empty set because there is no real number larger than all natural numbers. You have added "and R=inf X" where in case of the empty set the infimum is infinity and infinity is not a real number.
– Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
Nov 17 at 0:47
Actually, the topic of the paper I'm writing is precisely that there are real numbers larger than every natural number. I have a draft with a serious error in it (the one I made this question about) and you can have look if you ignore the catastrophically wrong error in Def 1.3: vixra.org/abs/1811.0222
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:56
In your paper, you postulate the existence of a number greater than any real number. Then you claim there are real numbers greater than it. That is nonsense.
– Sambo
Nov 17 at 6:19
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
According to your definition no natural number is arbitrary large so why are you trying to define something which you know it does not exist?
You may want to define the concept of a sequence diverging to infinity in which case you have a sequence $R_n$ which gets larger than any arbitrary number.
According to your definition no natural number is arbitrary large so why are you trying to define something which you know it does not exist?
You may want to define the concept of a sequence diverging to infinity in which case you have a sequence $R_n$ which gets larger than any arbitrary number.
answered Nov 16 at 23:36
Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
40.3k41958
40.3k41958
The issue was that did not even realize the implication that no such R exists until after I wrote it and ha it explained to me here! This is the one I think I will use instead: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:40
The new definition in not very helpful either.Your set $X$ is an empty set because there is no real number larger than all natural numbers. You have added "and R=inf X" where in case of the empty set the infimum is infinity and infinity is not a real number.
– Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
Nov 17 at 0:47
Actually, the topic of the paper I'm writing is precisely that there are real numbers larger than every natural number. I have a draft with a serious error in it (the one I made this question about) and you can have look if you ignore the catastrophically wrong error in Def 1.3: vixra.org/abs/1811.0222
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:56
In your paper, you postulate the existence of a number greater than any real number. Then you claim there are real numbers greater than it. That is nonsense.
– Sambo
Nov 17 at 6:19
add a comment |
The issue was that did not even realize the implication that no such R exists until after I wrote it and ha it explained to me here! This is the one I think I will use instead: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:40
The new definition in not very helpful either.Your set $X$ is an empty set because there is no real number larger than all natural numbers. You have added "and R=inf X" where in case of the empty set the infimum is infinity and infinity is not a real number.
– Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
Nov 17 at 0:47
Actually, the topic of the paper I'm writing is precisely that there are real numbers larger than every natural number. I have a draft with a serious error in it (the one I made this question about) and you can have look if you ignore the catastrophically wrong error in Def 1.3: vixra.org/abs/1811.0222
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:56
In your paper, you postulate the existence of a number greater than any real number. Then you claim there are real numbers greater than it. That is nonsense.
– Sambo
Nov 17 at 6:19
The issue was that did not even realize the implication that no such R exists until after I wrote it and ha it explained to me here! This is the one I think I will use instead: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:40
The issue was that did not even realize the implication that no such R exists until after I wrote it and ha it explained to me here! This is the one I think I will use instead: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:40
The new definition in not very helpful either.Your set $X$ is an empty set because there is no real number larger than all natural numbers. You have added "and R=inf X" where in case of the empty set the infimum is infinity and infinity is not a real number.
– Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
Nov 17 at 0:47
The new definition in not very helpful either.Your set $X$ is an empty set because there is no real number larger than all natural numbers. You have added "and R=inf X" where in case of the empty set the infimum is infinity and infinity is not a real number.
– Mohammad Riazi-Kermani
Nov 17 at 0:47
Actually, the topic of the paper I'm writing is precisely that there are real numbers larger than every natural number. I have a draft with a serious error in it (the one I made this question about) and you can have look if you ignore the catastrophically wrong error in Def 1.3: vixra.org/abs/1811.0222
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:56
Actually, the topic of the paper I'm writing is precisely that there are real numbers larger than every natural number. I have a draft with a serious error in it (the one I made this question about) and you can have look if you ignore the catastrophically wrong error in Def 1.3: vixra.org/abs/1811.0222
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:56
In your paper, you postulate the existence of a number greater than any real number. Then you claim there are real numbers greater than it. That is nonsense.
– Sambo
Nov 17 at 6:19
In your paper, you postulate the existence of a number greater than any real number. Then you claim there are real numbers greater than it. That is nonsense.
– Sambo
Nov 17 at 6:19
add a comment |
2
There is no such $R$. Whether you call it "for any" or "for all" is irrelevant to this point. You have 90% of a proof of this statement in your question. So yes, I suppose it's a perfectly valid definition, it's just that the first (and last interesting) theorem that you'll prove about it is "no natural number is arbitrarily large".
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:20
I see. I think I should replace the definition to say $xleq R$. What is your opinion on this modified definition?
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 16 at 23:27
Precisely the same, for precisely the same reason.
– user3482749
Nov 16 at 23:29
1
It sounds like you're trying to construct an infinity in the natural numbers, where infinity is greater than all natural numbers. There's something called the extended natural numbers, which describes exactly that.
– Kevin Long
Nov 16 at 23:30
I think this is what is what I was going for: $X={ xinmathbb{R}~~:~~n<x<infty~~forall~~ ninmathbb{N} }~~,qquadtext{and}qquad R=inf X nonumber$
– Jonathan Tooker
Nov 17 at 0:41