PTIJ: Aliyot for the deceased
Many people use the phrasing "may the Neshama have an Aliyah" at a shiva, shloshim, or yahrtzeit celebration. Which aliyah is better to give to the deceased? Shlishi, Shishi, or Maftir?
Also, when calling up the deceased for the Aliyah, does one change the formula to include an indication that they have passed?
This question is Purim Torah and is not intended to be taken completely seriously. See the Purim Torah policy.
purim-torah-in-jest
add a comment |
Many people use the phrasing "may the Neshama have an Aliyah" at a shiva, shloshim, or yahrtzeit celebration. Which aliyah is better to give to the deceased? Shlishi, Shishi, or Maftir?
Also, when calling up the deceased for the Aliyah, does one change the formula to include an indication that they have passed?
This question is Purim Torah and is not intended to be taken completely seriously. See the Purim Torah policy.
purim-torah-in-jest
1
They get Hagbah
– Double AA♦
Mar 7 at 16:42
Why specifically those three aliyot?
– Lo ani
Mar 7 at 17:04
When you asked the previous question, I sensed that you would ask about this one.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:01
@DanF which previous question?
– רבות מחשבות
Mar 7 at 21:37
@רבותמחשבות My mistake. There was another PTIJ question today about aliyot, but it was asked by rosends.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 21:47
add a comment |
Many people use the phrasing "may the Neshama have an Aliyah" at a shiva, shloshim, or yahrtzeit celebration. Which aliyah is better to give to the deceased? Shlishi, Shishi, or Maftir?
Also, when calling up the deceased for the Aliyah, does one change the formula to include an indication that they have passed?
This question is Purim Torah and is not intended to be taken completely seriously. See the Purim Torah policy.
purim-torah-in-jest
Many people use the phrasing "may the Neshama have an Aliyah" at a shiva, shloshim, or yahrtzeit celebration. Which aliyah is better to give to the deceased? Shlishi, Shishi, or Maftir?
Also, when calling up the deceased for the Aliyah, does one change the formula to include an indication that they have passed?
This question is Purim Torah and is not intended to be taken completely seriously. See the Purim Torah policy.
purim-torah-in-jest
purim-torah-in-jest
asked Mar 7 at 16:40
רבות מחשבותרבות מחשבות
14.4k128121
14.4k128121
1
They get Hagbah
– Double AA♦
Mar 7 at 16:42
Why specifically those three aliyot?
– Lo ani
Mar 7 at 17:04
When you asked the previous question, I sensed that you would ask about this one.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:01
@DanF which previous question?
– רבות מחשבות
Mar 7 at 21:37
@רבותמחשבות My mistake. There was another PTIJ question today about aliyot, but it was asked by rosends.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 21:47
add a comment |
1
They get Hagbah
– Double AA♦
Mar 7 at 16:42
Why specifically those three aliyot?
– Lo ani
Mar 7 at 17:04
When you asked the previous question, I sensed that you would ask about this one.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:01
@DanF which previous question?
– רבות מחשבות
Mar 7 at 21:37
@רבותמחשבות My mistake. There was another PTIJ question today about aliyot, but it was asked by rosends.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 21:47
1
1
They get Hagbah
– Double AA♦
Mar 7 at 16:42
They get Hagbah
– Double AA♦
Mar 7 at 16:42
Why specifically those three aliyot?
– Lo ani
Mar 7 at 17:04
Why specifically those three aliyot?
– Lo ani
Mar 7 at 17:04
When you asked the previous question, I sensed that you would ask about this one.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:01
When you asked the previous question, I sensed that you would ask about this one.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:01
@DanF which previous question?
– רבות מחשבות
Mar 7 at 21:37
@DanF which previous question?
– רבות מחשבות
Mar 7 at 21:37
@רבותמחשבות My mistake. There was another PTIJ question today about aliyot, but it was asked by rosends.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 21:47
@רבותמחשבות My mistake. There was another PTIJ question today about aliyot, but it was asked by rosends.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 21:47
add a comment |
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
You get maftir, thereby making them the niftar.
Excellent use of language!
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:02
add a comment |
The Mishnah (Gittin 59a) says:
כהן קורא ראשון ואחריו לוי ואחריו ישראל מפני דרכי שלום
A Kohen reads first, then a Levi, then a Yisrael, because of the ways of peace.
The Gemara (ibid. 59b) explains:
לא שנו אלא בסעודה אבל בבהכ"נ לא דאתו לאינצויי
They only taught [that one waits to accord respect] by a meal, but in a shul, we do not, for people will come to quarrel.
When coming to honor the deceased, everyone is obligated to pay their respects, and so there's no concern for quarrel; therefore, the deceased gets the first Aliyah. This is indicated by the Gemara's following question and answer:
והא רב הונא קרי בכהני בשבתות ויו"ט שאני רב הונא דאפילו רבי אמי ורבי אסי כהני חשיבי דא"י מיכף הוו כייפי ליה
Rav Huna read the Kohen aliyah on Shabbos and Yom Tov! Rav Huna is different, for even R' Ami and R' Asi, the most distinguished Kohanim in Eretz Yisrael, would bow to him.
Since everyone would pay respect to Rav Huna, he could take the Kohen aliyah, even without being a Kohen himself. So, too, since everyone pays respect to the deceased, he gets the Kohen aliyah.
add a comment |
There is an ancient custom of burying deceased Jews in Israel, dating all the way back to Yaakov Avinu. When people say this phrase, they are expressing their wish that the person will make aliya, so to speak, and be buried in Israel. If the person has already been buried, the bracha is still applicable as even the original occurrence of this practice involved exhuming the body and transporting it to Israel.
This doesn't answer the question. He asks which aliyah people should get.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:11
1
@DanF It does answer the question. He’s saying that the OP misunderstood the phrase “to get an Aliyah”.
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:12
@DonielF Ah, yes. that's implied by the 2nd paragraph.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:17
add a comment |
He gets the Levi aliyah. And this is regardless of whether he's a Levi or not.
The reason is that in a sense, during yahrtzeit, the spirit or "memory" of the dead person comes back down to Earth to be with the person who has Yahrtzeit. Yes, the dead person's neshama "gets an aliyah", but to get there, he needs a לוייה .
As a matter of fact, even a Cohen should get the Levi Aliyah and not the Cohen aliyah. Because even Cohanim need a לוייה .
Don’t we make a חילוק between before death and after death? What Aliyah do Leviim get? Also, מעלים בקודש ולא מורידין - why do Kohanim get downgraded to Levi?
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:11
@DonielF See the 2nd sentence. I said whether you're a Levi or not. See new edits above.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:16
The question was about what aliya the deceased should get.
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:35
I would have thought that לויית המת refers to the "levi aliya that you give a dead person".
– Nic
Mar 7 at 18:41
1
@Nic That seems reasonable. But if the deceased is a kohein, it seems to me that he should also get the kohein aliya, lest someone think the kohein who did get that aliya was pasul
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:49
|
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4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
You get maftir, thereby making them the niftar.
Excellent use of language!
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:02
add a comment |
You get maftir, thereby making them the niftar.
Excellent use of language!
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:02
add a comment |
You get maftir, thereby making them the niftar.
You get maftir, thereby making them the niftar.
answered Mar 7 at 16:59
MeirMeir
1,15619
1,15619
Excellent use of language!
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:02
add a comment |
Excellent use of language!
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:02
Excellent use of language!
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:02
Excellent use of language!
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:02
add a comment |
The Mishnah (Gittin 59a) says:
כהן קורא ראשון ואחריו לוי ואחריו ישראל מפני דרכי שלום
A Kohen reads first, then a Levi, then a Yisrael, because of the ways of peace.
The Gemara (ibid. 59b) explains:
לא שנו אלא בסעודה אבל בבהכ"נ לא דאתו לאינצויי
They only taught [that one waits to accord respect] by a meal, but in a shul, we do not, for people will come to quarrel.
When coming to honor the deceased, everyone is obligated to pay their respects, and so there's no concern for quarrel; therefore, the deceased gets the first Aliyah. This is indicated by the Gemara's following question and answer:
והא רב הונא קרי בכהני בשבתות ויו"ט שאני רב הונא דאפילו רבי אמי ורבי אסי כהני חשיבי דא"י מיכף הוו כייפי ליה
Rav Huna read the Kohen aliyah on Shabbos and Yom Tov! Rav Huna is different, for even R' Ami and R' Asi, the most distinguished Kohanim in Eretz Yisrael, would bow to him.
Since everyone would pay respect to Rav Huna, he could take the Kohen aliyah, even without being a Kohen himself. So, too, since everyone pays respect to the deceased, he gets the Kohen aliyah.
add a comment |
The Mishnah (Gittin 59a) says:
כהן קורא ראשון ואחריו לוי ואחריו ישראל מפני דרכי שלום
A Kohen reads first, then a Levi, then a Yisrael, because of the ways of peace.
The Gemara (ibid. 59b) explains:
לא שנו אלא בסעודה אבל בבהכ"נ לא דאתו לאינצויי
They only taught [that one waits to accord respect] by a meal, but in a shul, we do not, for people will come to quarrel.
When coming to honor the deceased, everyone is obligated to pay their respects, and so there's no concern for quarrel; therefore, the deceased gets the first Aliyah. This is indicated by the Gemara's following question and answer:
והא רב הונא קרי בכהני בשבתות ויו"ט שאני רב הונא דאפילו רבי אמי ורבי אסי כהני חשיבי דא"י מיכף הוו כייפי ליה
Rav Huna read the Kohen aliyah on Shabbos and Yom Tov! Rav Huna is different, for even R' Ami and R' Asi, the most distinguished Kohanim in Eretz Yisrael, would bow to him.
Since everyone would pay respect to Rav Huna, he could take the Kohen aliyah, even without being a Kohen himself. So, too, since everyone pays respect to the deceased, he gets the Kohen aliyah.
add a comment |
The Mishnah (Gittin 59a) says:
כהן קורא ראשון ואחריו לוי ואחריו ישראל מפני דרכי שלום
A Kohen reads first, then a Levi, then a Yisrael, because of the ways of peace.
The Gemara (ibid. 59b) explains:
לא שנו אלא בסעודה אבל בבהכ"נ לא דאתו לאינצויי
They only taught [that one waits to accord respect] by a meal, but in a shul, we do not, for people will come to quarrel.
When coming to honor the deceased, everyone is obligated to pay their respects, and so there's no concern for quarrel; therefore, the deceased gets the first Aliyah. This is indicated by the Gemara's following question and answer:
והא רב הונא קרי בכהני בשבתות ויו"ט שאני רב הונא דאפילו רבי אמי ורבי אסי כהני חשיבי דא"י מיכף הוו כייפי ליה
Rav Huna read the Kohen aliyah on Shabbos and Yom Tov! Rav Huna is different, for even R' Ami and R' Asi, the most distinguished Kohanim in Eretz Yisrael, would bow to him.
Since everyone would pay respect to Rav Huna, he could take the Kohen aliyah, even without being a Kohen himself. So, too, since everyone pays respect to the deceased, he gets the Kohen aliyah.
The Mishnah (Gittin 59a) says:
כהן קורא ראשון ואחריו לוי ואחריו ישראל מפני דרכי שלום
A Kohen reads first, then a Levi, then a Yisrael, because of the ways of peace.
The Gemara (ibid. 59b) explains:
לא שנו אלא בסעודה אבל בבהכ"נ לא דאתו לאינצויי
They only taught [that one waits to accord respect] by a meal, but in a shul, we do not, for people will come to quarrel.
When coming to honor the deceased, everyone is obligated to pay their respects, and so there's no concern for quarrel; therefore, the deceased gets the first Aliyah. This is indicated by the Gemara's following question and answer:
והא רב הונא קרי בכהני בשבתות ויו"ט שאני רב הונא דאפילו רבי אמי ורבי אסי כהני חשיבי דא"י מיכף הוו כייפי ליה
Rav Huna read the Kohen aliyah on Shabbos and Yom Tov! Rav Huna is different, for even R' Ami and R' Asi, the most distinguished Kohanim in Eretz Yisrael, would bow to him.
Since everyone would pay respect to Rav Huna, he could take the Kohen aliyah, even without being a Kohen himself. So, too, since everyone pays respect to the deceased, he gets the Kohen aliyah.
answered Mar 7 at 18:23
DonielFDonielF
15.6k12482
15.6k12482
add a comment |
add a comment |
There is an ancient custom of burying deceased Jews in Israel, dating all the way back to Yaakov Avinu. When people say this phrase, they are expressing their wish that the person will make aliya, so to speak, and be buried in Israel. If the person has already been buried, the bracha is still applicable as even the original occurrence of this practice involved exhuming the body and transporting it to Israel.
This doesn't answer the question. He asks which aliyah people should get.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:11
1
@DanF It does answer the question. He’s saying that the OP misunderstood the phrase “to get an Aliyah”.
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:12
@DonielF Ah, yes. that's implied by the 2nd paragraph.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:17
add a comment |
There is an ancient custom of burying deceased Jews in Israel, dating all the way back to Yaakov Avinu. When people say this phrase, they are expressing their wish that the person will make aliya, so to speak, and be buried in Israel. If the person has already been buried, the bracha is still applicable as even the original occurrence of this practice involved exhuming the body and transporting it to Israel.
This doesn't answer the question. He asks which aliyah people should get.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:11
1
@DanF It does answer the question. He’s saying that the OP misunderstood the phrase “to get an Aliyah”.
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:12
@DonielF Ah, yes. that's implied by the 2nd paragraph.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:17
add a comment |
There is an ancient custom of burying deceased Jews in Israel, dating all the way back to Yaakov Avinu. When people say this phrase, they are expressing their wish that the person will make aliya, so to speak, and be buried in Israel. If the person has already been buried, the bracha is still applicable as even the original occurrence of this practice involved exhuming the body and transporting it to Israel.
There is an ancient custom of burying deceased Jews in Israel, dating all the way back to Yaakov Avinu. When people say this phrase, they are expressing their wish that the person will make aliya, so to speak, and be buried in Israel. If the person has already been buried, the bracha is still applicable as even the original occurrence of this practice involved exhuming the body and transporting it to Israel.
answered Mar 7 at 17:46
DanielDaniel
15.4k331109
15.4k331109
This doesn't answer the question. He asks which aliyah people should get.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:11
1
@DanF It does answer the question. He’s saying that the OP misunderstood the phrase “to get an Aliyah”.
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:12
@DonielF Ah, yes. that's implied by the 2nd paragraph.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:17
add a comment |
This doesn't answer the question. He asks which aliyah people should get.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:11
1
@DanF It does answer the question. He’s saying that the OP misunderstood the phrase “to get an Aliyah”.
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:12
@DonielF Ah, yes. that's implied by the 2nd paragraph.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:17
This doesn't answer the question. He asks which aliyah people should get.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:11
This doesn't answer the question. He asks which aliyah people should get.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:11
1
1
@DanF It does answer the question. He’s saying that the OP misunderstood the phrase “to get an Aliyah”.
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:12
@DanF It does answer the question. He’s saying that the OP misunderstood the phrase “to get an Aliyah”.
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:12
@DonielF Ah, yes. that's implied by the 2nd paragraph.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:17
@DonielF Ah, yes. that's implied by the 2nd paragraph.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:17
add a comment |
He gets the Levi aliyah. And this is regardless of whether he's a Levi or not.
The reason is that in a sense, during yahrtzeit, the spirit or "memory" of the dead person comes back down to Earth to be with the person who has Yahrtzeit. Yes, the dead person's neshama "gets an aliyah", but to get there, he needs a לוייה .
As a matter of fact, even a Cohen should get the Levi Aliyah and not the Cohen aliyah. Because even Cohanim need a לוייה .
Don’t we make a חילוק between before death and after death? What Aliyah do Leviim get? Also, מעלים בקודש ולא מורידין - why do Kohanim get downgraded to Levi?
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:11
@DonielF See the 2nd sentence. I said whether you're a Levi or not. See new edits above.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:16
The question was about what aliya the deceased should get.
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:35
I would have thought that לויית המת refers to the "levi aliya that you give a dead person".
– Nic
Mar 7 at 18:41
1
@Nic That seems reasonable. But if the deceased is a kohein, it seems to me that he should also get the kohein aliya, lest someone think the kohein who did get that aliya was pasul
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:49
|
show 2 more comments
He gets the Levi aliyah. And this is regardless of whether he's a Levi or not.
The reason is that in a sense, during yahrtzeit, the spirit or "memory" of the dead person comes back down to Earth to be with the person who has Yahrtzeit. Yes, the dead person's neshama "gets an aliyah", but to get there, he needs a לוייה .
As a matter of fact, even a Cohen should get the Levi Aliyah and not the Cohen aliyah. Because even Cohanim need a לוייה .
Don’t we make a חילוק between before death and after death? What Aliyah do Leviim get? Also, מעלים בקודש ולא מורידין - why do Kohanim get downgraded to Levi?
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:11
@DonielF See the 2nd sentence. I said whether you're a Levi or not. See new edits above.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:16
The question was about what aliya the deceased should get.
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:35
I would have thought that לויית המת refers to the "levi aliya that you give a dead person".
– Nic
Mar 7 at 18:41
1
@Nic That seems reasonable. But if the deceased is a kohein, it seems to me that he should also get the kohein aliya, lest someone think the kohein who did get that aliya was pasul
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:49
|
show 2 more comments
He gets the Levi aliyah. And this is regardless of whether he's a Levi or not.
The reason is that in a sense, during yahrtzeit, the spirit or "memory" of the dead person comes back down to Earth to be with the person who has Yahrtzeit. Yes, the dead person's neshama "gets an aliyah", but to get there, he needs a לוייה .
As a matter of fact, even a Cohen should get the Levi Aliyah and not the Cohen aliyah. Because even Cohanim need a לוייה .
He gets the Levi aliyah. And this is regardless of whether he's a Levi or not.
The reason is that in a sense, during yahrtzeit, the spirit or "memory" of the dead person comes back down to Earth to be with the person who has Yahrtzeit. Yes, the dead person's neshama "gets an aliyah", but to get there, he needs a לוייה .
As a matter of fact, even a Cohen should get the Levi Aliyah and not the Cohen aliyah. Because even Cohanim need a לוייה .
edited Mar 7 at 19:02
answered Mar 7 at 18:07
DanFDanF
34.5k528127
34.5k528127
Don’t we make a חילוק between before death and after death? What Aliyah do Leviim get? Also, מעלים בקודש ולא מורידין - why do Kohanim get downgraded to Levi?
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:11
@DonielF See the 2nd sentence. I said whether you're a Levi or not. See new edits above.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:16
The question was about what aliya the deceased should get.
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:35
I would have thought that לויית המת refers to the "levi aliya that you give a dead person".
– Nic
Mar 7 at 18:41
1
@Nic That seems reasonable. But if the deceased is a kohein, it seems to me that he should also get the kohein aliya, lest someone think the kohein who did get that aliya was pasul
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:49
|
show 2 more comments
Don’t we make a חילוק between before death and after death? What Aliyah do Leviim get? Also, מעלים בקודש ולא מורידין - why do Kohanim get downgraded to Levi?
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:11
@DonielF See the 2nd sentence. I said whether you're a Levi or not. See new edits above.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:16
The question was about what aliya the deceased should get.
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:35
I would have thought that לויית המת refers to the "levi aliya that you give a dead person".
– Nic
Mar 7 at 18:41
1
@Nic That seems reasonable. But if the deceased is a kohein, it seems to me that he should also get the kohein aliya, lest someone think the kohein who did get that aliya was pasul
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:49
Don’t we make a חילוק between before death and after death? What Aliyah do Leviim get? Also, מעלים בקודש ולא מורידין - why do Kohanim get downgraded to Levi?
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:11
Don’t we make a חילוק between before death and after death? What Aliyah do Leviim get? Also, מעלים בקודש ולא מורידין - why do Kohanim get downgraded to Levi?
– DonielF
Mar 7 at 18:11
@DonielF See the 2nd sentence. I said whether you're a Levi or not. See new edits above.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:16
@DonielF See the 2nd sentence. I said whether you're a Levi or not. See new edits above.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:16
The question was about what aliya the deceased should get.
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:35
The question was about what aliya the deceased should get.
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:35
I would have thought that לויית המת refers to the "levi aliya that you give a dead person".
– Nic
Mar 7 at 18:41
I would have thought that לויית המת refers to the "levi aliya that you give a dead person".
– Nic
Mar 7 at 18:41
1
1
@Nic That seems reasonable. But if the deceased is a kohein, it seems to me that he should also get the kohein aliya, lest someone think the kohein who did get that aliya was pasul
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:49
@Nic That seems reasonable. But if the deceased is a kohein, it seems to me that he should also get the kohein aliya, lest someone think the kohein who did get that aliya was pasul
– Daniel
Mar 7 at 18:49
|
show 2 more comments
1
They get Hagbah
– Double AA♦
Mar 7 at 16:42
Why specifically those three aliyot?
– Lo ani
Mar 7 at 17:04
When you asked the previous question, I sensed that you would ask about this one.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 18:01
@DanF which previous question?
– רבות מחשבות
Mar 7 at 21:37
@רבותמחשבות My mistake. There was another PTIJ question today about aliyot, but it was asked by rosends.
– DanF
Mar 7 at 21:47