Composition of a differential map and a smooth map
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In DoCarmo’s Riemannian Geometry book, it is written that if $phi$ is a smooth map from $M$ to $M$, $vin T_pM$, and f is a real-valued smooth map in a neighborhood of $phi(p)$, then we have $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)=v(fcirc phi)(p)$.
In this book, a tangent vector $v$ at $p$ is defined as a mapping of the set of real-valued smooth maps at p to $mathbb R$.
With those definitions and notations, the equality above does not make sense, since for example $(dphi(v)f)$ is already a real number, not a function, so $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)$ is wrong. So what does the author mean?
Appendix: this remark exactly in this form is used in proving $[X,Y](p)=lim_{trightarrow 0}1/ttimes(Y-dphi_t Y)(phi_t(p))$. Hence additionally I could not understand the left side of this equality.
differential-geometry riemannian-geometry smooth-manifolds
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In DoCarmo’s Riemannian Geometry book, it is written that if $phi$ is a smooth map from $M$ to $M$, $vin T_pM$, and f is a real-valued smooth map in a neighborhood of $phi(p)$, then we have $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)=v(fcirc phi)(p)$.
In this book, a tangent vector $v$ at $p$ is defined as a mapping of the set of real-valued smooth maps at p to $mathbb R$.
With those definitions and notations, the equality above does not make sense, since for example $(dphi(v)f)$ is already a real number, not a function, so $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)$ is wrong. So what does the author mean?
Appendix: this remark exactly in this form is used in proving $[X,Y](p)=lim_{trightarrow 0}1/ttimes(Y-dphi_t Y)(phi_t(p))$. Hence additionally I could not understand the left side of this equality.
differential-geometry riemannian-geometry smooth-manifolds
Can you tell on what page and in which paragraph you found this?
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 14:26
On page 26, second paragraph
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 14:28
2
DoCarmo says "$v in T_pM$", but it should be "$v$ a vector field".
– Aloizio Macedo♦
Nov 16 at 14:59
@AloizioMacedo as an apparently Brazilian like DoCarmo, your remark is right to the point. Thanks
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 15:02
@Selflearner Indeed... I was too focused on the "$vin T_p M$"... Anyway, thanks very much for the question, I learnt something today! + 1
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 15:15
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
In DoCarmo’s Riemannian Geometry book, it is written that if $phi$ is a smooth map from $M$ to $M$, $vin T_pM$, and f is a real-valued smooth map in a neighborhood of $phi(p)$, then we have $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)=v(fcirc phi)(p)$.
In this book, a tangent vector $v$ at $p$ is defined as a mapping of the set of real-valued smooth maps at p to $mathbb R$.
With those definitions and notations, the equality above does not make sense, since for example $(dphi(v)f)$ is already a real number, not a function, so $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)$ is wrong. So what does the author mean?
Appendix: this remark exactly in this form is used in proving $[X,Y](p)=lim_{trightarrow 0}1/ttimes(Y-dphi_t Y)(phi_t(p))$. Hence additionally I could not understand the left side of this equality.
differential-geometry riemannian-geometry smooth-manifolds
In DoCarmo’s Riemannian Geometry book, it is written that if $phi$ is a smooth map from $M$ to $M$, $vin T_pM$, and f is a real-valued smooth map in a neighborhood of $phi(p)$, then we have $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)=v(fcirc phi)(p)$.
In this book, a tangent vector $v$ at $p$ is defined as a mapping of the set of real-valued smooth maps at p to $mathbb R$.
With those definitions and notations, the equality above does not make sense, since for example $(dphi(v)f)$ is already a real number, not a function, so $(dphi(v)f)phi(p)$ is wrong. So what does the author mean?
Appendix: this remark exactly in this form is used in proving $[X,Y](p)=lim_{trightarrow 0}1/ttimes(Y-dphi_t Y)(phi_t(p))$. Hence additionally I could not understand the left side of this equality.
differential-geometry riemannian-geometry smooth-manifolds
differential-geometry riemannian-geometry smooth-manifolds
edited Nov 16 at 14:52
asked Nov 16 at 14:22
Selflearner
377214
377214
Can you tell on what page and in which paragraph you found this?
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 14:26
On page 26, second paragraph
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 14:28
2
DoCarmo says "$v in T_pM$", but it should be "$v$ a vector field".
– Aloizio Macedo♦
Nov 16 at 14:59
@AloizioMacedo as an apparently Brazilian like DoCarmo, your remark is right to the point. Thanks
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 15:02
@Selflearner Indeed... I was too focused on the "$vin T_p M$"... Anyway, thanks very much for the question, I learnt something today! + 1
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 15:15
|
show 1 more comment
Can you tell on what page and in which paragraph you found this?
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 14:26
On page 26, second paragraph
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 14:28
2
DoCarmo says "$v in T_pM$", but it should be "$v$ a vector field".
– Aloizio Macedo♦
Nov 16 at 14:59
@AloizioMacedo as an apparently Brazilian like DoCarmo, your remark is right to the point. Thanks
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 15:02
@Selflearner Indeed... I was too focused on the "$vin T_p M$"... Anyway, thanks very much for the question, I learnt something today! + 1
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 15:15
Can you tell on what page and in which paragraph you found this?
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 14:26
Can you tell on what page and in which paragraph you found this?
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 14:26
On page 26, second paragraph
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 14:28
On page 26, second paragraph
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 14:28
2
2
DoCarmo says "$v in T_pM$", but it should be "$v$ a vector field".
– Aloizio Macedo♦
Nov 16 at 14:59
DoCarmo says "$v in T_pM$", but it should be "$v$ a vector field".
– Aloizio Macedo♦
Nov 16 at 14:59
@AloizioMacedo as an apparently Brazilian like DoCarmo, your remark is right to the point. Thanks
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 15:02
@AloizioMacedo as an apparently Brazilian like DoCarmo, your remark is right to the point. Thanks
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 15:02
@Selflearner Indeed... I was too focused on the "$vin T_p M$"... Anyway, thanks very much for the question, I learnt something today! + 1
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 15:15
@Selflearner Indeed... I was too focused on the "$vin T_p M$"... Anyway, thanks very much for the question, I learnt something today! + 1
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 15:15
|
show 1 more comment
1 Answer
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1
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You are correct. If $v in T_pM$, the expression $dphi(v) f$ is a real number.
But the expression "$(dphi(v)f)(phi(p))$" has a problem, even if $v$ is a vector field: What is "$dphi(v)$"? This is not necessarily well-defined as a vector field on $M$ if $phi$ is just smooth. Luckily it is in the case that $phi$ is a diffeomorphism. These things also make sense when $phi$ is a local diffeomorphism, but then you have vector fields defined on some open set $U$ and, accordingly, $phi(U)$. (In particular, it makes sense in the context of Lemma 5.5.)
As you mention, DoCarmo later uses the expression in the proof of another proposition:
(...) Accordingly,
$((dvarphi_tY)f)(varphi_t(p))=(Y(f circ varphi_t))(p)$ (...)
(For context, here $varphi_t$ is a local flow.) Therefore, as far as what he seems to be interested in is concerned, there is no problem in correcting his equality by saying that $v$ should be a vector field.
For more information, see the wikipedia section on pushforward of vector fields, for example.
Thanks, I had so much difficulty understanding the meaning of that theorem, even asked a question here but I was looking for an answer like yours
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 16:16
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
You are correct. If $v in T_pM$, the expression $dphi(v) f$ is a real number.
But the expression "$(dphi(v)f)(phi(p))$" has a problem, even if $v$ is a vector field: What is "$dphi(v)$"? This is not necessarily well-defined as a vector field on $M$ if $phi$ is just smooth. Luckily it is in the case that $phi$ is a diffeomorphism. These things also make sense when $phi$ is a local diffeomorphism, but then you have vector fields defined on some open set $U$ and, accordingly, $phi(U)$. (In particular, it makes sense in the context of Lemma 5.5.)
As you mention, DoCarmo later uses the expression in the proof of another proposition:
(...) Accordingly,
$((dvarphi_tY)f)(varphi_t(p))=(Y(f circ varphi_t))(p)$ (...)
(For context, here $varphi_t$ is a local flow.) Therefore, as far as what he seems to be interested in is concerned, there is no problem in correcting his equality by saying that $v$ should be a vector field.
For more information, see the wikipedia section on pushforward of vector fields, for example.
Thanks, I had so much difficulty understanding the meaning of that theorem, even asked a question here but I was looking for an answer like yours
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 16:16
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
You are correct. If $v in T_pM$, the expression $dphi(v) f$ is a real number.
But the expression "$(dphi(v)f)(phi(p))$" has a problem, even if $v$ is a vector field: What is "$dphi(v)$"? This is not necessarily well-defined as a vector field on $M$ if $phi$ is just smooth. Luckily it is in the case that $phi$ is a diffeomorphism. These things also make sense when $phi$ is a local diffeomorphism, but then you have vector fields defined on some open set $U$ and, accordingly, $phi(U)$. (In particular, it makes sense in the context of Lemma 5.5.)
As you mention, DoCarmo later uses the expression in the proof of another proposition:
(...) Accordingly,
$((dvarphi_tY)f)(varphi_t(p))=(Y(f circ varphi_t))(p)$ (...)
(For context, here $varphi_t$ is a local flow.) Therefore, as far as what he seems to be interested in is concerned, there is no problem in correcting his equality by saying that $v$ should be a vector field.
For more information, see the wikipedia section on pushforward of vector fields, for example.
Thanks, I had so much difficulty understanding the meaning of that theorem, even asked a question here but I was looking for an answer like yours
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 16:16
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
You are correct. If $v in T_pM$, the expression $dphi(v) f$ is a real number.
But the expression "$(dphi(v)f)(phi(p))$" has a problem, even if $v$ is a vector field: What is "$dphi(v)$"? This is not necessarily well-defined as a vector field on $M$ if $phi$ is just smooth. Luckily it is in the case that $phi$ is a diffeomorphism. These things also make sense when $phi$ is a local diffeomorphism, but then you have vector fields defined on some open set $U$ and, accordingly, $phi(U)$. (In particular, it makes sense in the context of Lemma 5.5.)
As you mention, DoCarmo later uses the expression in the proof of another proposition:
(...) Accordingly,
$((dvarphi_tY)f)(varphi_t(p))=(Y(f circ varphi_t))(p)$ (...)
(For context, here $varphi_t$ is a local flow.) Therefore, as far as what he seems to be interested in is concerned, there is no problem in correcting his equality by saying that $v$ should be a vector field.
For more information, see the wikipedia section on pushforward of vector fields, for example.
You are correct. If $v in T_pM$, the expression $dphi(v) f$ is a real number.
But the expression "$(dphi(v)f)(phi(p))$" has a problem, even if $v$ is a vector field: What is "$dphi(v)$"? This is not necessarily well-defined as a vector field on $M$ if $phi$ is just smooth. Luckily it is in the case that $phi$ is a diffeomorphism. These things also make sense when $phi$ is a local diffeomorphism, but then you have vector fields defined on some open set $U$ and, accordingly, $phi(U)$. (In particular, it makes sense in the context of Lemma 5.5.)
As you mention, DoCarmo later uses the expression in the proof of another proposition:
(...) Accordingly,
$((dvarphi_tY)f)(varphi_t(p))=(Y(f circ varphi_t))(p)$ (...)
(For context, here $varphi_t$ is a local flow.) Therefore, as far as what he seems to be interested in is concerned, there is no problem in correcting his equality by saying that $v$ should be a vector field.
For more information, see the wikipedia section on pushforward of vector fields, for example.
answered Nov 16 at 15:37
Aloizio Macedo♦
23.3k23485
23.3k23485
Thanks, I had so much difficulty understanding the meaning of that theorem, even asked a question here but I was looking for an answer like yours
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 16:16
add a comment |
Thanks, I had so much difficulty understanding the meaning of that theorem, even asked a question here but I was looking for an answer like yours
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 16:16
Thanks, I had so much difficulty understanding the meaning of that theorem, even asked a question here but I was looking for an answer like yours
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 16:16
Thanks, I had so much difficulty understanding the meaning of that theorem, even asked a question here but I was looking for an answer like yours
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 16:16
add a comment |
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Can you tell on what page and in which paragraph you found this?
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 14:26
On page 26, second paragraph
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 14:28
2
DoCarmo says "$v in T_pM$", but it should be "$v$ a vector field".
– Aloizio Macedo♦
Nov 16 at 14:59
@AloizioMacedo as an apparently Brazilian like DoCarmo, your remark is right to the point. Thanks
– Selflearner
Nov 16 at 15:02
@Selflearner Indeed... I was too focused on the "$vin T_p M$"... Anyway, thanks very much for the question, I learnt something today! + 1
– Ernie060
Nov 16 at 15:15