Show that $lim_{p to infty} | f |_p = | f |_infty$












0












$begingroup$


In a space with measure $1$, $||f||_p$ is an increasing function with respect of $p$. To show that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ we have to show that $||f||_{infty}$ is the supremum, right??



To show that, we assume that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum.



From the essential supremum we have that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})=0$.



So, we have to show that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



How could we continue to show that $m(A)>0$??



EDIT:



Is it as followed??



We have that $0<||f||_{infty}-epsilon<||f||_{infty}$ for some $epsilon>0$.



$||f||_{infty}$ is the essential supremum. So, from the definition we have that $mleft ( {|f(x)>||f||_{infty}-epsilon} right )>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



Taking the limit $p rightarrow +infty$ we have the following:



$$lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p overset{ m(A)>0 Rightarrow lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p}=1}{Longrightarrow} \ ||f||_{infty}-epsilon<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p$$



Is this correct?? How do we conclude that $lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ ??










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$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    You know that $m({|f| > |f|_infty - epsilon}) > 0$ by definition of $|f|_infty$ as the smallest constant such that $m(ldots) = 0$.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:22










  • $begingroup$
    @AlexR I got stuck right now...Could you explain it further to me??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:25










  • $begingroup$
    $$|f|_infty = mathop{rm ess;sup} |f| = inf_{m(N) = 0} sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)|$$ Should say it all, no? Note that $m({|f| > C}) = 0 Rightarrow C ge |f|_infty$ due to the $inf$-part.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:27


















0












$begingroup$


In a space with measure $1$, $||f||_p$ is an increasing function with respect of $p$. To show that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ we have to show that $||f||_{infty}$ is the supremum, right??



To show that, we assume that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum.



From the essential supremum we have that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})=0$.



So, we have to show that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



How could we continue to show that $m(A)>0$??



EDIT:



Is it as followed??



We have that $0<||f||_{infty}-epsilon<||f||_{infty}$ for some $epsilon>0$.



$||f||_{infty}$ is the essential supremum. So, from the definition we have that $mleft ( {|f(x)>||f||_{infty}-epsilon} right )>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



Taking the limit $p rightarrow +infty$ we have the following:



$$lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p overset{ m(A)>0 Rightarrow lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p}=1}{Longrightarrow} \ ||f||_{infty}-epsilon<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p$$



Is this correct?? How do we conclude that $lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ ??










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    You know that $m({|f| > |f|_infty - epsilon}) > 0$ by definition of $|f|_infty$ as the smallest constant such that $m(ldots) = 0$.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:22










  • $begingroup$
    @AlexR I got stuck right now...Could you explain it further to me??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:25










  • $begingroup$
    $$|f|_infty = mathop{rm ess;sup} |f| = inf_{m(N) = 0} sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)|$$ Should say it all, no? Note that $m({|f| > C}) = 0 Rightarrow C ge |f|_infty$ due to the $inf$-part.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:27
















0












0








0


0



$begingroup$


In a space with measure $1$, $||f||_p$ is an increasing function with respect of $p$. To show that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ we have to show that $||f||_{infty}$ is the supremum, right??



To show that, we assume that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum.



From the essential supremum we have that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})=0$.



So, we have to show that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



How could we continue to show that $m(A)>0$??



EDIT:



Is it as followed??



We have that $0<||f||_{infty}-epsilon<||f||_{infty}$ for some $epsilon>0$.



$||f||_{infty}$ is the essential supremum. So, from the definition we have that $mleft ( {|f(x)>||f||_{infty}-epsilon} right )>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



Taking the limit $p rightarrow +infty$ we have the following:



$$lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p overset{ m(A)>0 Rightarrow lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p}=1}{Longrightarrow} \ ||f||_{infty}-epsilon<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p$$



Is this correct?? How do we conclude that $lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ ??










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




In a space with measure $1$, $||f||_p$ is an increasing function with respect of $p$. To show that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ we have to show that $||f||_{infty}$ is the supremum, right??



To show that, we assume that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum.



From the essential supremum we have that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})=0$.



So, we have to show that $m({|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon})>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



How could we continue to show that $m(A)>0$??



EDIT:



Is it as followed??



We have that $0<||f||_{infty}-epsilon<||f||_{infty}$ for some $epsilon>0$.



$||f||_{infty}$ is the essential supremum. So, from the definition we have that $mleft ( {|f(x)>||f||_{infty}-epsilon} right )>0$.



Let $A={|f|>||f||_{infty}-epsilon}$.



We have that $int_A |f|^p leq int |f|^p leq ||f||_{infty}^p$.



$int_A |f|^p >int_A (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p=(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)^p m(A)$



So, $m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<||f||_p leq ||f||_{infty}$



Taking the limit $p rightarrow +infty$ we have the following:



$$lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p} (||f||_{infty}-epsilon)<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p overset{ m(A)>0 Rightarrow lim_{p rightarrow +infty}m(A)^{1/p}=1}{Longrightarrow} \ ||f||_{infty}-epsilon<lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p$$



Is this correct?? How do we conclude that $lim_{p rightarrow +infty} ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}$ ??







real-analysis analysis measure-theory proof-verification






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share|cite|improve this question













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edited Dec 6 '18 at 12:44









Brahadeesh

6,47942363




6,47942363










asked Dec 8 '14 at 15:16









Mary StarMary Star

3,10282473




3,10282473








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    You know that $m({|f| > |f|_infty - epsilon}) > 0$ by definition of $|f|_infty$ as the smallest constant such that $m(ldots) = 0$.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:22










  • $begingroup$
    @AlexR I got stuck right now...Could you explain it further to me??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:25










  • $begingroup$
    $$|f|_infty = mathop{rm ess;sup} |f| = inf_{m(N) = 0} sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)|$$ Should say it all, no? Note that $m({|f| > C}) = 0 Rightarrow C ge |f|_infty$ due to the $inf$-part.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:27
















  • 1




    $begingroup$
    You know that $m({|f| > |f|_infty - epsilon}) > 0$ by definition of $|f|_infty$ as the smallest constant such that $m(ldots) = 0$.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:22










  • $begingroup$
    @AlexR I got stuck right now...Could you explain it further to me??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:25










  • $begingroup$
    $$|f|_infty = mathop{rm ess;sup} |f| = inf_{m(N) = 0} sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)|$$ Should say it all, no? Note that $m({|f| > C}) = 0 Rightarrow C ge |f|_infty$ due to the $inf$-part.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:27










1




1




$begingroup$
You know that $m({|f| > |f|_infty - epsilon}) > 0$ by definition of $|f|_infty$ as the smallest constant such that $m(ldots) = 0$.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 8 '14 at 15:22




$begingroup$
You know that $m({|f| > |f|_infty - epsilon}) > 0$ by definition of $|f|_infty$ as the smallest constant such that $m(ldots) = 0$.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 8 '14 at 15:22












$begingroup$
@AlexR I got stuck right now...Could you explain it further to me??
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 15:25




$begingroup$
@AlexR I got stuck right now...Could you explain it further to me??
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 15:25












$begingroup$
$$|f|_infty = mathop{rm ess;sup} |f| = inf_{m(N) = 0} sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)|$$ Should say it all, no? Note that $m({|f| > C}) = 0 Rightarrow C ge |f|_infty$ due to the $inf$-part.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 8 '14 at 15:27






$begingroup$
$$|f|_infty = mathop{rm ess;sup} |f| = inf_{m(N) = 0} sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)|$$ Should say it all, no? Note that $m({|f| > C}) = 0 Rightarrow C ge |f|_infty$ due to the $inf$-part.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 8 '14 at 15:27












2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















3












$begingroup$

First of all you have to show that $||f||_infty$ is a superior bound. But this is immediate by the definition of $| cdot|_infty$.



Now you want to show that, for all $epsilon$ we have $$lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$$



As already observed and using your notation, $m(A) = m(|f| > ||f||_infty -epsilon)>0$. Now putting the things together you got



$$|f|_p > (||f||_infty- epsilon)m(A)^{1/p}$$ for all values of $p$. Now just take the limit, which exists since the sequence is increasing and bounded, to obtain what you desire.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Do you mean that it is as followed?? $$(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)lim m(A)^{(1/p)}<lim ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}-epsilonRightarrow lim m(A)^{(1/p)}=1Rightarrow m(A)neq 0$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:59






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $m(A) > 0$ by the definition of $ess sup |f|$. You don't have to care about $m(A)$, since it is positive. You just have to show what I wrote above: $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$. Because you already have that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p le ||f||_infty$.
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 16:03










  • $begingroup$
    Haven't we assumed that $m(A)=0$ and we want to find a conradiction, that means that we want to find that $m(A)>0$ ?? We assume, to get a contradiction, that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum. Does that mean that the limit of $||f||_p$ when $p rightarrow +infty$ is equal to $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ ??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:06






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $|f|_|{infty}$ is exactly what AlexR commented above. That definition implies that your set $A$ has positive measure. We don't want to prove $m(A) > 0$ we already know that from $|f|_{infty}$. When you take the limit at both sides of the last inequality in may answer you get that $lim_{prightarrow infty} ||f||_p > |f|_{infty} - epsilon$ for all $epsilon$... Did I make it clear?
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:39








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    AlexR's answer is exactly about this question. Just change $C$ in his answer by $|f|_{infty} - epsilon$
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:10





















1












$begingroup$

The final step follows from the definition of the essential supremum.




Proposition

If $m({|f| > C}) = 0$ then necessarily $C ge |f|_infty$.




Proof

Let $N := {|f|>C}$. By assumption $m(N) = 0$. This means
$$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
as was to be shown.



Now use this proposition together with your initial steps to conclude a contradiction for $C = |f|_infty - epsilon < |f|_infty$.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    So, do we not show it in the way I started??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 22:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Unfortunately your estimates are "in the wrong direction", so yeah, you're out of luck with that start.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:05










  • $begingroup$
    Could you explain me the following?? $$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:14






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Since $m(N) = 0$ we know that ${N' : m(N') = 0}$ contains $N$, thus the infimum must be at most the value for a particular element: $$inf_{xin S} f(x) le f(x_0) qquadforall x_0in S$$
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 13:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @MaryStar That's okay. Now you showed that $|f|_infty-epsilon$ is a lower bound for the limit for all $epsilon > 0$, i.e. $lim |f|_p ge |f|_infty$. On the other hand it's an elementary estimate that $|f|_p le |f|_infty$ so $lim|f|_p le |f|_infty$. Conclude equaltiy.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 15:36











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2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes








2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes









3












$begingroup$

First of all you have to show that $||f||_infty$ is a superior bound. But this is immediate by the definition of $| cdot|_infty$.



Now you want to show that, for all $epsilon$ we have $$lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$$



As already observed and using your notation, $m(A) = m(|f| > ||f||_infty -epsilon)>0$. Now putting the things together you got



$$|f|_p > (||f||_infty- epsilon)m(A)^{1/p}$$ for all values of $p$. Now just take the limit, which exists since the sequence is increasing and bounded, to obtain what you desire.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Do you mean that it is as followed?? $$(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)lim m(A)^{(1/p)}<lim ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}-epsilonRightarrow lim m(A)^{(1/p)}=1Rightarrow m(A)neq 0$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:59






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $m(A) > 0$ by the definition of $ess sup |f|$. You don't have to care about $m(A)$, since it is positive. You just have to show what I wrote above: $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$. Because you already have that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p le ||f||_infty$.
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 16:03










  • $begingroup$
    Haven't we assumed that $m(A)=0$ and we want to find a conradiction, that means that we want to find that $m(A)>0$ ?? We assume, to get a contradiction, that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum. Does that mean that the limit of $||f||_p$ when $p rightarrow +infty$ is equal to $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ ??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:06






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $|f|_|{infty}$ is exactly what AlexR commented above. That definition implies that your set $A$ has positive measure. We don't want to prove $m(A) > 0$ we already know that from $|f|_{infty}$. When you take the limit at both sides of the last inequality in may answer you get that $lim_{prightarrow infty} ||f||_p > |f|_{infty} - epsilon$ for all $epsilon$... Did I make it clear?
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:39








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    AlexR's answer is exactly about this question. Just change $C$ in his answer by $|f|_{infty} - epsilon$
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:10


















3












$begingroup$

First of all you have to show that $||f||_infty$ is a superior bound. But this is immediate by the definition of $| cdot|_infty$.



Now you want to show that, for all $epsilon$ we have $$lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$$



As already observed and using your notation, $m(A) = m(|f| > ||f||_infty -epsilon)>0$. Now putting the things together you got



$$|f|_p > (||f||_infty- epsilon)m(A)^{1/p}$$ for all values of $p$. Now just take the limit, which exists since the sequence is increasing and bounded, to obtain what you desire.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    Do you mean that it is as followed?? $$(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)lim m(A)^{(1/p)}<lim ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}-epsilonRightarrow lim m(A)^{(1/p)}=1Rightarrow m(A)neq 0$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:59






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $m(A) > 0$ by the definition of $ess sup |f|$. You don't have to care about $m(A)$, since it is positive. You just have to show what I wrote above: $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$. Because you already have that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p le ||f||_infty$.
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 16:03










  • $begingroup$
    Haven't we assumed that $m(A)=0$ and we want to find a conradiction, that means that we want to find that $m(A)>0$ ?? We assume, to get a contradiction, that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum. Does that mean that the limit of $||f||_p$ when $p rightarrow +infty$ is equal to $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ ??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:06






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $|f|_|{infty}$ is exactly what AlexR commented above. That definition implies that your set $A$ has positive measure. We don't want to prove $m(A) > 0$ we already know that from $|f|_{infty}$. When you take the limit at both sides of the last inequality in may answer you get that $lim_{prightarrow infty} ||f||_p > |f|_{infty} - epsilon$ for all $epsilon$... Did I make it clear?
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:39








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    AlexR's answer is exactly about this question. Just change $C$ in his answer by $|f|_{infty} - epsilon$
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:10
















3












3








3





$begingroup$

First of all you have to show that $||f||_infty$ is a superior bound. But this is immediate by the definition of $| cdot|_infty$.



Now you want to show that, for all $epsilon$ we have $$lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$$



As already observed and using your notation, $m(A) = m(|f| > ||f||_infty -epsilon)>0$. Now putting the things together you got



$$|f|_p > (||f||_infty- epsilon)m(A)^{1/p}$$ for all values of $p$. Now just take the limit, which exists since the sequence is increasing and bounded, to obtain what you desire.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$



First of all you have to show that $||f||_infty$ is a superior bound. But this is immediate by the definition of $| cdot|_infty$.



Now you want to show that, for all $epsilon$ we have $$lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$$



As already observed and using your notation, $m(A) = m(|f| > ||f||_infty -epsilon)>0$. Now putting the things together you got



$$|f|_p > (||f||_infty- epsilon)m(A)^{1/p}$$ for all values of $p$. Now just take the limit, which exists since the sequence is increasing and bounded, to obtain what you desire.







share|cite|improve this answer












share|cite|improve this answer



share|cite|improve this answer










answered Dec 8 '14 at 15:49









Rodrigo RibeiroRodrigo Ribeiro

1,266811




1,266811












  • $begingroup$
    Do you mean that it is as followed?? $$(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)lim m(A)^{(1/p)}<lim ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}-epsilonRightarrow lim m(A)^{(1/p)}=1Rightarrow m(A)neq 0$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:59






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $m(A) > 0$ by the definition of $ess sup |f|$. You don't have to care about $m(A)$, since it is positive. You just have to show what I wrote above: $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$. Because you already have that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p le ||f||_infty$.
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 16:03










  • $begingroup$
    Haven't we assumed that $m(A)=0$ and we want to find a conradiction, that means that we want to find that $m(A)>0$ ?? We assume, to get a contradiction, that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum. Does that mean that the limit of $||f||_p$ when $p rightarrow +infty$ is equal to $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ ??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:06






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $|f|_|{infty}$ is exactly what AlexR commented above. That definition implies that your set $A$ has positive measure. We don't want to prove $m(A) > 0$ we already know that from $|f|_{infty}$. When you take the limit at both sides of the last inequality in may answer you get that $lim_{prightarrow infty} ||f||_p > |f|_{infty} - epsilon$ for all $epsilon$... Did I make it clear?
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:39








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    AlexR's answer is exactly about this question. Just change $C$ in his answer by $|f|_{infty} - epsilon$
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:10




















  • $begingroup$
    Do you mean that it is as followed?? $$(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)lim m(A)^{(1/p)}<lim ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}-epsilonRightarrow lim m(A)^{(1/p)}=1Rightarrow m(A)neq 0$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 15:59






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $m(A) > 0$ by the definition of $ess sup |f|$. You don't have to care about $m(A)$, since it is positive. You just have to show what I wrote above: $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$. Because you already have that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p le ||f||_infty$.
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 16:03










  • $begingroup$
    Haven't we assumed that $m(A)=0$ and we want to find a conradiction, that means that we want to find that $m(A)>0$ ?? We assume, to get a contradiction, that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum. Does that mean that the limit of $||f||_p$ when $p rightarrow +infty$ is equal to $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ ??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:06






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    $|f|_|{infty}$ is exactly what AlexR commented above. That definition implies that your set $A$ has positive measure. We don't want to prove $m(A) > 0$ we already know that from $|f|_{infty}$. When you take the limit at both sides of the last inequality in may answer you get that $lim_{prightarrow infty} ||f||_p > |f|_{infty} - epsilon$ for all $epsilon$... Did I make it clear?
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 19:39








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    AlexR's answer is exactly about this question. Just change $C$ in his answer by $|f|_{infty} - epsilon$
    $endgroup$
    – Rodrigo Ribeiro
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:10


















$begingroup$
Do you mean that it is as followed?? $$(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)lim m(A)^{(1/p)}<lim ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}-epsilonRightarrow lim m(A)^{(1/p)}=1Rightarrow m(A)neq 0$$
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 15:59




$begingroup$
Do you mean that it is as followed?? $$(||f||_{infty}-epsilon)lim m(A)^{(1/p)}<lim ||f||_p=||f||_{infty}-epsilonRightarrow lim m(A)^{(1/p)}=1Rightarrow m(A)neq 0$$
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 15:59




1




1




$begingroup$
$m(A) > 0$ by the definition of $ess sup |f|$. You don't have to care about $m(A)$, since it is positive. You just have to show what I wrote above: $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$. Because you already have that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p le ||f||_infty$.
$endgroup$
– Rodrigo Ribeiro
Dec 8 '14 at 16:03




$begingroup$
$m(A) > 0$ by the definition of $ess sup |f|$. You don't have to care about $m(A)$, since it is positive. You just have to show what I wrote above: $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p > ||f||_infty - epsilon$. Because you already have that $lim_{p rightarrow infty} |f|_p le ||f||_infty$.
$endgroup$
– Rodrigo Ribeiro
Dec 8 '14 at 16:03












$begingroup$
Haven't we assumed that $m(A)=0$ and we want to find a conradiction, that means that we want to find that $m(A)>0$ ?? We assume, to get a contradiction, that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum. Does that mean that the limit of $||f||_p$ when $p rightarrow +infty$ is equal to $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ ??
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 19:06




$begingroup$
Haven't we assumed that $m(A)=0$ and we want to find a conradiction, that means that we want to find that $m(A)>0$ ?? We assume, to get a contradiction, that $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ is the supremum. Does that mean that the limit of $||f||_p$ when $p rightarrow +infty$ is equal to $||f||_{infty}-epsilon$ ??
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 19:06




1




1




$begingroup$
$|f|_|{infty}$ is exactly what AlexR commented above. That definition implies that your set $A$ has positive measure. We don't want to prove $m(A) > 0$ we already know that from $|f|_{infty}$. When you take the limit at both sides of the last inequality in may answer you get that $lim_{prightarrow infty} ||f||_p > |f|_{infty} - epsilon$ for all $epsilon$... Did I make it clear?
$endgroup$
– Rodrigo Ribeiro
Dec 8 '14 at 19:39






$begingroup$
$|f|_|{infty}$ is exactly what AlexR commented above. That definition implies that your set $A$ has positive measure. We don't want to prove $m(A) > 0$ we already know that from $|f|_{infty}$. When you take the limit at both sides of the last inequality in may answer you get that $lim_{prightarrow infty} ||f||_p > |f|_{infty} - epsilon$ for all $epsilon$... Did I make it clear?
$endgroup$
– Rodrigo Ribeiro
Dec 8 '14 at 19:39






1




1




$begingroup$
AlexR's answer is exactly about this question. Just change $C$ in his answer by $|f|_{infty} - epsilon$
$endgroup$
– Rodrigo Ribeiro
Dec 8 '14 at 23:10






$begingroup$
AlexR's answer is exactly about this question. Just change $C$ in his answer by $|f|_{infty} - epsilon$
$endgroup$
– Rodrigo Ribeiro
Dec 8 '14 at 23:10













1












$begingroup$

The final step follows from the definition of the essential supremum.




Proposition

If $m({|f| > C}) = 0$ then necessarily $C ge |f|_infty$.




Proof

Let $N := {|f|>C}$. By assumption $m(N) = 0$. This means
$$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
as was to be shown.



Now use this proposition together with your initial steps to conclude a contradiction for $C = |f|_infty - epsilon < |f|_infty$.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    So, do we not show it in the way I started??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 22:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Unfortunately your estimates are "in the wrong direction", so yeah, you're out of luck with that start.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:05










  • $begingroup$
    Could you explain me the following?? $$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:14






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Since $m(N) = 0$ we know that ${N' : m(N') = 0}$ contains $N$, thus the infimum must be at most the value for a particular element: $$inf_{xin S} f(x) le f(x_0) qquadforall x_0in S$$
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 13:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @MaryStar That's okay. Now you showed that $|f|_infty-epsilon$ is a lower bound for the limit for all $epsilon > 0$, i.e. $lim |f|_p ge |f|_infty$. On the other hand it's an elementary estimate that $|f|_p le |f|_infty$ so $lim|f|_p le |f|_infty$. Conclude equaltiy.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 15:36
















1












$begingroup$

The final step follows from the definition of the essential supremum.




Proposition

If $m({|f| > C}) = 0$ then necessarily $C ge |f|_infty$.




Proof

Let $N := {|f|>C}$. By assumption $m(N) = 0$. This means
$$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
as was to be shown.



Now use this proposition together with your initial steps to conclude a contradiction for $C = |f|_infty - epsilon < |f|_infty$.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    So, do we not show it in the way I started??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 22:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Unfortunately your estimates are "in the wrong direction", so yeah, you're out of luck with that start.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:05










  • $begingroup$
    Could you explain me the following?? $$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:14






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Since $m(N) = 0$ we know that ${N' : m(N') = 0}$ contains $N$, thus the infimum must be at most the value for a particular element: $$inf_{xin S} f(x) le f(x_0) qquadforall x_0in S$$
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 13:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @MaryStar That's okay. Now you showed that $|f|_infty-epsilon$ is a lower bound for the limit for all $epsilon > 0$, i.e. $lim |f|_p ge |f|_infty$. On the other hand it's an elementary estimate that $|f|_p le |f|_infty$ so $lim|f|_p le |f|_infty$. Conclude equaltiy.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 15:36














1












1








1





$begingroup$

The final step follows from the definition of the essential supremum.




Proposition

If $m({|f| > C}) = 0$ then necessarily $C ge |f|_infty$.




Proof

Let $N := {|f|>C}$. By assumption $m(N) = 0$. This means
$$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
as was to be shown.



Now use this proposition together with your initial steps to conclude a contradiction for $C = |f|_infty - epsilon < |f|_infty$.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$



The final step follows from the definition of the essential supremum.




Proposition

If $m({|f| > C}) = 0$ then necessarily $C ge |f|_infty$.




Proof

Let $N := {|f|>C}$. By assumption $m(N) = 0$. This means
$$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
as was to be shown.



Now use this proposition together with your initial steps to conclude a contradiction for $C = |f|_infty - epsilon < |f|_infty$.







share|cite|improve this answer












share|cite|improve this answer



share|cite|improve this answer










answered Dec 8 '14 at 15:40









AlexRAlexR

22.7k12349




22.7k12349












  • $begingroup$
    So, do we not show it in the way I started??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 22:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Unfortunately your estimates are "in the wrong direction", so yeah, you're out of luck with that start.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:05










  • $begingroup$
    Could you explain me the following?? $$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:14






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Since $m(N) = 0$ we know that ${N' : m(N') = 0}$ contains $N$, thus the infimum must be at most the value for a particular element: $$inf_{xin S} f(x) le f(x_0) qquadforall x_0in S$$
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 13:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @MaryStar That's okay. Now you showed that $|f|_infty-epsilon$ is a lower bound for the limit for all $epsilon > 0$, i.e. $lim |f|_p ge |f|_infty$. On the other hand it's an elementary estimate that $|f|_p le |f|_infty$ so $lim|f|_p le |f|_infty$. Conclude equaltiy.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 15:36


















  • $begingroup$
    So, do we not show it in the way I started??
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 22:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Unfortunately your estimates are "in the wrong direction", so yeah, you're out of luck with that start.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:05










  • $begingroup$
    Could you explain me the following?? $$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
    $endgroup$
    – Mary Star
    Dec 8 '14 at 23:14






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Since $m(N) = 0$ we know that ${N' : m(N') = 0}$ contains $N$, thus the infimum must be at most the value for a particular element: $$inf_{xin S} f(x) le f(x_0) qquadforall x_0in S$$
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 13:40






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @MaryStar That's okay. Now you showed that $|f|_infty-epsilon$ is a lower bound for the limit for all $epsilon > 0$, i.e. $lim |f|_p ge |f|_infty$. On the other hand it's an elementary estimate that $|f|_p le |f|_infty$ so $lim|f|_p le |f|_infty$. Conclude equaltiy.
    $endgroup$
    – AlexR
    Dec 9 '14 at 15:36
















$begingroup$
So, do we not show it in the way I started??
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 22:40




$begingroup$
So, do we not show it in the way I started??
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 22:40




1




1




$begingroup$
Unfortunately your estimates are "in the wrong direction", so yeah, you're out of luck with that start.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 8 '14 at 23:05




$begingroup$
Unfortunately your estimates are "in the wrong direction", so yeah, you're out of luck with that start.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 8 '14 at 23:05












$begingroup$
Could you explain me the following?? $$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 23:14




$begingroup$
Could you explain me the following?? $$|f|_infty = inf_{m(N') = 0} sup_{xnotin N'} |f(x)| le sup_{xnotin N} |f(x)| = sup_{{|f| > C}} |f(x)| le C$$
$endgroup$
– Mary Star
Dec 8 '14 at 23:14




1




1




$begingroup$
Since $m(N) = 0$ we know that ${N' : m(N') = 0}$ contains $N$, thus the infimum must be at most the value for a particular element: $$inf_{xin S} f(x) le f(x_0) qquadforall x_0in S$$
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 9 '14 at 13:40




$begingroup$
Since $m(N) = 0$ we know that ${N' : m(N') = 0}$ contains $N$, thus the infimum must be at most the value for a particular element: $$inf_{xin S} f(x) le f(x_0) qquadforall x_0in S$$
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 9 '14 at 13:40




1




1




$begingroup$
@MaryStar That's okay. Now you showed that $|f|_infty-epsilon$ is a lower bound for the limit for all $epsilon > 0$, i.e. $lim |f|_p ge |f|_infty$. On the other hand it's an elementary estimate that $|f|_p le |f|_infty$ so $lim|f|_p le |f|_infty$. Conclude equaltiy.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 9 '14 at 15:36




$begingroup$
@MaryStar That's okay. Now you showed that $|f|_infty-epsilon$ is a lower bound for the limit for all $epsilon > 0$, i.e. $lim |f|_p ge |f|_infty$. On the other hand it's an elementary estimate that $|f|_p le |f|_infty$ so $lim|f|_p le |f|_infty$. Conclude equaltiy.
$endgroup$
– AlexR
Dec 9 '14 at 15:36


















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