Is 'datus' used for a date in Latin?
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
add a comment |
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 13:58
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 15:15
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:26
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:29
add a comment |
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
etymologia time calendarium
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
asked Jan 2 at 13:20
Joonas Ilmavirta♦Joonas Ilmavirta
45.9k1058263
45.9k1058263
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 13:58
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 15:15
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:26
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:29
add a comment |
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 13:58
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 15:15
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:26
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:29
2
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 13:58
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 13:58
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 15:15
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 15:15
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:26
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:26
1
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:29
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:29
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
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For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
Jan 2 at 21:12
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 22:13
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
add a comment |
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
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For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
Jan 2 at 21:12
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 22:13
add a comment |
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
Jan 2 at 21:12
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 22:13
add a comment |
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
answered Jan 2 at 18:33
fdbfdb
10.6k11127
10.6k11127
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
Jan 2 at 21:12
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 22:13
add a comment |
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
Jan 2 at 21:12
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 22:13
2
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
Jan 2 at 21:12
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
Jan 2 at 21:12
1
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 22:13
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 22:13
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
answered Jan 2 at 22:41
Tom CottonTom Cotton
13.9k11144
13.9k11144
add a comment |
add a comment |
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2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 13:58
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
Jan 2 at 15:15
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:26
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
Jan 2 at 16:29